New Zoom R16 portable recorder

[64Guitars]

Silent, 24 bit multitracking with multiple inputs.  I find harddrive machines too noisy for acoustic stuff.

Yes. I've always preferred memory cards to hard drives too. Memory cards are silent, rugged, and they're getting bigger and cheaper all the time. And when you've got a USB Host connector, who needs an internal hard drive? Memory cards provide lots of silent internal storage and you have unlimited offline storage via USB Host. That's the best storage solution for a recorder in my opinion.

[guitarron]

it's a midi controller too-tempting

[64Guitars]

The R16 looks like an incredible recorder but, aside from the lack of midi and drum machine, it has one more drawback that I should point out. Although it has 16 playback tracks, it only has 8 faders. So the 16 tracks are divided into two banks and you select which bank the faders will control by a switch. This sounds pretty reasonable in theory, but it can be very frustrating in practice.

Consider this example. You've recorded to the first 8 tracks and have now switched to the second bank to begin recording those tracks. You record something to track 9, completing the song, and now you want to set the levels for your final mix. So you switch to bank 1 and carefully set all the faders. Lets say that you've set the track 1 fader at the 0 mark. You then switch to bank 2 and adjust track 9, which shares the same fader control as track 1. You want track 9's level to be much lower in the mix and set the fader to about -10. Great! All the levels are now set, so you reset the counter to zero and begin the bounce of your final mix. During the bounce, you decide to make a slight adjustment to track 1's level, so you switch back to bank 1. This is where the problem arises. Track 1 is currently set at 0, but the physical position of the fader control is at -10, where you left it when adjusting track 9. As soon as you touch the fader, the level of track 1 instantly drops from 0 to -10 where the fader control is positioned! So you raise the fader back up to, say, -2. Now you want to adjust the level of track 9 so you switch to bank 2. You have the same problem again because the physical position of the fader (-2) no longer corresponds to the actual track level(-10) of track 9. As soon as you touch the fader, track 9's level will jump from -10 to -2 to match the physical position.

The only solution to this problem would be to use motorized faders in the R16 so that their positions could be automatically adjusted to match the actual track levels whenever the bank is switched. But that would likely increase the price of the R16 considerably.

I find that most of my recordings are 8 tracks or less, so this bank switching problem might not be a very big concern for me. For the few times that I'd venture into the second bank, I could probably live with the problem. But anyone who plans to routinely record more than 8 tracks should take this bank switching quirk into consideration. On the other hand, the only alternative would be a more expensive recorder like the HD16 or BR-1600 which have a separate fader for each track or track pair. So, bank switching might be a trade-off you're willing to accept in order to get the low price and great features of the R16. And you could always bounce after 8 tracks so that you're always working in the first track bank only.

[SteveB]

I'm a Newbie so I don't want to muddy anyone's waters (Possible name check there, eh?). But the last post is what made me reluctantly move off my beloved Br864 to the Br 900 - those damn faders!!

[64Guitars]

I know what you mean SteveB. I still use a BR-864 and I've learned to live with the bank switched faders, although I wish I didn't have to.

A couple more potential problems have been brought to my attention regarding the R16. Apparently, it doesn't have any v-tracks! This is a bit surprising to me because Zoom has always had plenty of v-tracks in their recorders (10 per track versus Boss' 8). And it seems that the R16 offers little or no track editing within the unit. So all editing would have to be done on the computer. With no drum machine and no MIDI, it seems that the R16 is too dependant on computers to be very useful as a stand-alone portable recorder.

Zoom has finally announced the R16 on their website:

http://www.zoom.co.jp/english/news/news283/index.php

The R16 product page is here:

http://www.zoom.co.jp/english/products/r16/index.php

And the manuals can be downloaded here:

http://www.zoom.co.jp/english/download/manual/english.php

I haven't had a chance to read the manuals yet, but they should give a much better understanding of the pros and cons of this recorder.

[SteveB]

Interesting, I cant wait for Rolands next generation of digital multitrack recorders.

DV - I don't know whether you mean Roland specifically, or Roland/Boss in the shape of further development of the BR range? The thing that I've found, and I have to admit, that apart from initial fiddling around with a Tascam 'tape' portastudio, I've only ever had BR-products - I'm now on the BR1200, is that once you've found a product (Or range of products) that suit your needs, you're as well sticking with them. These machines - and this applies to me, you and everyone else - can only do so much, ultimately it's down to each of us to knuckle down and do the business. Boss have released upgrade versions via their website, so once you've got the hardware - the physical product (The BR1200CD in my case), it's just a case of keeping up with the upgrades. As far as I'm aware, Boss have no plans for bringing in any new versions anytime soon. Moving upto the 20-track Roland VS-20 etc would be the next logical move.

[Davo]

So you dont think there will be any gen-2 micro br's in the next few years?  I have noticed that the competition has been upgrading their field recorders fairly often.

I know what your are saying about being up to us to make use of these recorders.

Ive spent weeks learning to use the Boss GT-8 and am still learning alot about the micro BR.  Im now familiar with the Boss/Roland method of operation so I will probably stick to them in the future.

[SteveB]

DV - Well you can never say never obviously. But think of the economics involved. I have to admit that I've never used a Micro-BR etc, I started with the BR864. But once you've got the hardware, as I say, and that includes the Micro-series, it will be cheaper for Boss/Roland to release upgrades of their software to fit already within what is there, rather than going through the whole process on developing a new physical piece of equipment. And presumably, once you've used one Boss product, the thinking behind it will be, well I'm satisfied with that, I'll move on up through the range. And as I've now pointed out elsewhere on the boards, once you've reached a certain level of technology-in-a-box, well beyond that becomes defeating, because you are turning into a recording enthusiast rather than a musician who enjoys playing and putting songs etc together. Anyway, I think we're clogging up a Zoom Thread with Boss products, so if you want more chat etc - start a thread on the relevant board.