"Gone" by The Stan Laurels (Final Mix and Original 2002 Shit-Mix)

[Bluesberry]

If you want to hear the evolution of a song in action, I will soon post the ORIGINAL mix I did of this song about 6 or 7 years ago on the BR-8.  It's absolutely horrid.  Makes you appreciate the final mix even more.

I would be very interested in hearing this Bosko, for scientific research purposes.

[Oldrottenhead]

i think this is a great version as are both others,  a word of caution to you tho boscko you can get too close to a song and as the author, you sometimes only see the faults, i know that is a problem i have. and you can spend too much time trying to get it perfect to your ears, but then you let friends hear the different versions and they dont notice the difference.

what you have is a great song that stands up on its own no matter the mix so dont be too hard on yourself, that said i am away to remix something i'm not happy with lol.

as a postscript. frank blacks record teenager of the year took him about a year to record, is a great record one of his best, he hates it and prefers his original demos, he thinks he took the vitality out of the sngs with endless production. in his band frank black and the catholics he teaches his band the new song he has written lets them practice a bit then into the studio and records live to a two track tape, for two reasons, it captures the vitality of the song and he cant go back and tinker with it.

[Bosko Schwartz]

Kody, thanks a lot!  I always appreciate your kind words!  Yes, a 28" kick drum -- 2 inches bigger than my drum hero's kick (John Bonham, 26").  I will try to post a pic soon.  I use a cheap set of Nady drum mics which have little convenient clips to attach to the drum rims.  There were 7 mics in the set: one for the kick, one for each of the two toms, two for the snare (top and bottom), and two condenser mics on stands above the cymbals.  I also use my Behringer B-1 condenser mic, which I use for vox, as a room mic for the drums, so 8 mics total.  Incidentally, I recently found all your stuff in the 900 room (which is almost as lonely as this one) and listened to a bunch of your songs and commented, and I have to say I was impressed, especially by your voice!

Thanks, 48, always appreciated!

Bluesberry, look no further.  As requested, the original mix is below ...

ORH, I completely understand what you are saying and agree.  Frank Black Francis is
a genius of our time and one of the greatest songwriters/singers ever.  However, in my defense, I submit for your listening loathement exhibit A: the original mix of this song done 7 years ago on the BR-8.  It even has programmed drums because I lived in an apartment.  Also, the beginning and end are cut off for some odd unknown reason that doesn't matter anymore.  The point is that many of my esteemed peers in this forum have so kindly said that my work sounds "professional" or "polished," and yet others have said that I need to know when to walk away from a mix.  I contend that in order to get that sound, I needed to spend the insane amount of time I have tweaking the nights away.  See, production doesn't come easy to me.  It's a struggle.  But my strive for perfection will never end because I'm not George Martin and it's not 1967.  This is also a response to Greeny's quote below about my stuff:

As 48 points out, it's almost in a different league to the rest of us. That doesn't mean that there's jealousy on here, just an awkwardness for some people in knowing what to say. Remember that there a some people who have been here a long time, and we've seen them grow and improve over time. This track alone shows that you are already at a level way beyond what most of us will ever get to.

Now, although Greeny was being far too kind in that post, after listening to this mix below, you will understand how I have evolved and why I continue to tweak mixes that perhaps sound finished to most people's ears.  However, ORH, I do see your point and I will make a conscious effort to tweak less, if for no other reason than to save my sanity and a lot of time.

Thanks for everyone's kind feedback!!!

[Oldrottenhead]

boscko you are way too hard on yersel , okay this is not a patch on later versions but the song still shines through, actually you could release this as a remixed version by dj shadow and folk would say " man this is the best version" actually this version is growing on me it has the vitality of the first take kinda thing going on.

great song,

boscko

go easy on yer ears

luv ya baby

[Bosko Schwartz]

Ah, oldrottenhead, you should be renamed oldstubbornhead.  You stick to your word no matter what, eh?  Even when you know this mix is absolutely horrific.  I appreciate your words, however, and I will say that I agree that the root song is still there and still completely intact.  As for the vitality of a first take, it may have that, but I tend to think of it more as the Pathetic Pains of Amateur Hour.

You can go on listening to the original, but I think that maybe, just maybe, the final mix is just a tad more suitable for the upcoming album.

Thanks again for all of the encouragement, ORH!!!

[Oldrottenhead]

Ah, oldrottenhead, you should be renamed oldstubbornhead

you are starting to sound like my wife lol. all im saying is dont throw out the babywith the bathwater

[launched]

Wow, this song's journey has been a long one! I agree that it only sounds different, not any worse. The new take has tons more power and additional ear candy.

I won't say anymore so I don't get my head bitten off!!


You are a talented devil - thanks for sharing all of this!

Catch you later,

Mark

as a postscript. frank blacks record teenager of the year took him about a year to record, is a great record one of his best, he hates it and prefers his original demos, he thinks he took the vitality out of the sngs with endless production. in his band frank black and the catholics he teaches his band the new song he has written lets them practice a bit then into the studio and records live to a two track tape, for two reasons, it captures the vitality of the song and he cant go back and tinker with it.

A big Frank Black Frances/Pixies fan myself. Surfer Rosa, Doolittle and Teenager of the Year never, ever leave my mp3 player - TOTY was a highly produced album, however.

Frank Black, while with the Pixies before singlehandedly wiping them off the face of the planet forever, got a chance to work with Steve Albini for one album. I'm sure a lot rubbed off there. I really enjoy his 2 track recordings - very impressive!

[indierik]

Bosko, this is F@%$ing fantastic! And you think your lyrics aren't any good, shit man, you can write lyrics for me any day. I haven't had the time to listen to all the mixes or read all the posts, but I really like what I'm hearing. I read one small blurb about you "not being a professional otherwise you'd be getting paid for this". Well, you sound like a professional and soon enough you'll be getting paid for this, people will soon enough recognize your talent and be beating down your door. I read something a while ago about "art for the masses" why some art is more popular than others. It's because we are like sheep, if someone tells us the Mona Lisa is a great painting we believe them. It doesn't mean it's any better than Guernica, for example, it just means we are followers, this is why when I went to the louve the only paint to have a crowd around it was the Mona Lisa. In the same artuicle They did a study with different groups "creating an artificial "music market" in which 14,341 participants downloaded previously unknown songs either with or without knowledge of previous participants' choices. Increasing the strength of social influence increased both inequality and unpredictability of success. Success was also only partly determined by quality: The best songs rarely did poorly, and the worst rarely did well, but any other result was possible." The songs most downloaded were the ones in which the downloader could see how many times that song had been downloaded before them. In the end they said if you are an aspiring artists and have yet to be discovered that certainly doesn't mean you don't have the talent and it doesn't mean you wont find success and recognition eventually.

Anyways, I believe with a little hard work and a touch of luck I am confident you'll find success! You most certainly have the talent!

gotta run.

erik 

[Satchwood]

            I think it sounds flippin great - luv the guitar now!!

I think you got a really cool falsetto voice!

                  - great job tweaking this to perfection Bosko!!

[Greeny]

I bloody love this song, Bosco! The mix is there. Done. Move on to the next masterpiece! I produce a lot of material because I've learned (as orh points out as a technique) to trust my instincts and keep things as original and spontaneous as possible. OK - this is only really possible when you've done a lot of recording and mixing and just 'know' what sounds right, but it sounds as if you have that kind of ear and experience too. Sometimes you can get way too close to a song. If a song doesn't work first time, I know that I have to leave it and go back to it MUCH later when I can 'hear' it properly (i.e. when I can listen to the song itself and not all the tiny sounds and notes and problems). I'll usually end up re-recording the whole thing - and totally differently.

Anyway, I'm rambling. This is a wonderful song. You should be proud of it!